luke 17:34 rapture

I like Joseph's answer, which if no other answers turn in will receive my check. (10) But the men put forth their hand, and pulled Lot into the house 35 Two women will be grinding grain together; one will be taken and the other left. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. The eagles will be gathered together as they will speak a multitude of words as they will persecute those that leave them. Two women shall be grinding together; the one, Ellicott's Commentary for English Readers. He has revealed to us the" mystery of his will"(Ephesians 1:9) Learning about it can lead to salvation and can provide you with a glimpse into the Creator's unfathomable wisdom. This means that both Luke 17:30-35 and Matthew 24:37-41 are events that will occur after the second coming of Christ. together; one will be taken and one will be left. therefore, for you do not know on what day your Lord is coming. 2 It would be better for him if a millstone [as large as one turned by a donkey] were hung around his neck and he were hurled into the sea, than . Now lets read the verses you are referring to in (Luke 3436): I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other left. this place: (13) For we will destroy this place, because the cry of Please see, Welcome and thank you for your contribution. Jesus says to "flee to the mountains" in Matthew 24. In verse 26, Jesus resembled the days of Noah with His second coming: And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man. In this passage it is even clearer that Jesus was referring to His second coming because He said the coming of the Son of Man. This means the illustration of the two men in the field or the two women grinding is not about the rapture. I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed: One will be taken and the other left. The question we are to consider in this paper is the interpretation of part of the Lords words in the Olivet Discourse (Matthew 24:1-44) and the Lords answer to the Pharisees question, When the kingdom of God should come? in Luke17:20. de Lectis Veter. Does two men in the field, one taken and one left refer to the rapture? In one case those left are judged and in the other case those left are blessed! The words quoted in Luke 17 come after the Lord had answered the Pharisees question about the timing of the Kingdom of God. It only takes a minute to sign up. We must "ARISE" and go away from the company of the "dead"the unbelievers who will hear the revealed Word of Truth and will not believe in it when they do. Remember Lots wife. The same statement is found in Matthew 24:28 except that the word "body" is replaced with "carcase". The NASB simply translates the word as two. As can be seen the angel in the foreground is depicted with eagles wings. that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, Luke 17:34 (NIV). "The kingdoms of this world have become the kingdom of the Lord and of his Christ, and he shall reign forever and ever" (Revelation 11:15b). Two men walking up a hill,/ One disappears and one's left standing still;/ I wish we'd all been ready. I was less than satisfied with the Matt. The body is the dead body of unbelievers we are to leave behind in order to follow Jesus. We must also leave the churches of the unbelievers in this coming time or be consumed in the iniquity of the city as we may render evil for their evil if we stay too long. It has come to my attention, and as I understand it, that those who insist that the rapture verses of Matthew 24:40-41 and Luke 17:34-36 are, in their opinion, a judgment of the unsaved, are saying that the Greek word "paralambn" - as found in another passage of Scripture - can carry the connotation of judgment. Here is a blog post that explains it in more detail: https://overcomingthetribulation.com/carcasses-eagles-and-taken/. Recovering from a blunder I made while emailing a professor. gather., 37 "And answering they *said to Him, Where, Lord? And He said to Noah were, so will be the coming of the Son of Man. he might be revealed in his time. This is symbolically represented in two examples. Luke 17:34 The believers are left and will be with Christ on the earth during the Millennium. Those whom Jesus said would be left would be those who heeded the warning and fled to the mountains. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his Enter your email to receive new articles straight to your Inbox, The Herald of Hope He replied, Where there is a dead body, there the vultures will gather.. Matthew 24:40-41 (NASB) Event After the Second Coming of Christ the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the (15) And when the morning arose, then presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: The short answer is that in the narratives of Matt 24, Lk 21, and Mk 13, Jesus is speaking of the siege of Jerusalem and the destruction of the Temple by the armies of Rome. I would like to comment on the Lords words in Luke 17:34-37 and Matthew 24:40-41. And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? In the book of Daniel 9:26 it states "The end will come like a flood" Here is a parallel that liken the two ends as similar. judge him in the last day. John 14:3). Like in the wheat and the weeds parable. For instance, of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his Instructions. Some understand it to mean that the Son of Man will inevitably appear just as eagles inevitably show up where there is carrion. Verse 37 in Luke immediately follows the description of the rapture of believers (verses 34-36). Below you will see three different translations of the original Greek Koine. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Further, Jesus teaches that the ones left will be destroyed completely not have seven years of another chance to repent as the secret rapture belief teaches. Lot, Hast thou here any besides? (37) And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? Your's is the answer I believe most correctly describes the passage: it flies in the face of the "Left Behind" methodology, but it accurately describes the language used. There is no rapture here. Two men will be in the field: the one will be taken and the other left. Luke 17:31 Commentaries: "On that day, the one who is on the housetop and whose goods are in the house must not go down to take them out; and likewise the one who is in the field must not turn back. eg. Is the Goat and Sheep judgment also the White Throne judgment? We've added a "Necessary cookies only" option to the cookie consent popup. Search. (32) Remember Lot's wife. This is a picture* of angels that are in the process of transporting from earth newly departed peoples' souls, through the legendary dark tunnel, to the heavenly light in the far distance. Many will resist what He has to say with a multitude of evil words that will fly out of their mouths into the "air". unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be 35 There will be two women grinding together. One will be taken and the other left. Sadly, this verse has been used to support the secret rapture belief. So how do we interpret the words of Jesus when He said that in one night there would a global disappearance of individuals from bed, the field and at the mill? 2) The Gospels must be interpreted as addressed to Israel and not the Church because a new dispensation of the Church had not begun at the time. Other Translations for Luke 17:34 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shal be taken, the other shall be left. 52:49. After Jesus said, one would be taken and the other left, the disciples asked where they would be left. Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together., The eagles are farsighted birds , spiritually far sighted individuals are likened to eagles and will be taken along "for salvation" and will gather together where the body is," to the Spiritual Wedding Feast prepared by the King - "God." Thank you for contributing. It is a compound word composed of a preposition para meaning near and a verb, lambano meaning I receive. Jesus stresses the Necessity for watchfulness-, to keep ready, Jesus explains. or 'There!' The image is from a painting by: Hieronymus Bosch. Since those who subscribe to amillennialism don't believe in rapture, how do they interpret Luke 17:30-34. We all agree on that point. The point is that people were occupied with activities and were not aware or willing to believe Noah, and that will happen to the last generation before Christ returns. Perhaps it means that the ones taken will be disenfranchised, their goods confiscated and their rights terminated as a "felony". Who is being taken in Matthew 24:40-41? The word for the bird is generic in both accounts. For the coming of the Son of Man will be just like the days of Noah. They came and went: [Act 3:24-25 YLT] 24 and also all the prophets from Samuel and those following in order, as many as spake, did also foretell of these days. Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy Here is Luke 17:30-33, It will be just the same on the day that the Son of Man is revealed. expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter Time will tell! Again, these fowl in Revelation 19 are the multitude of words of the unbelievers who will not believe in the true sayings of God when the Scriptures are opened up by the Lord to our hearing ears. In other words, an equally legitimate interpretation of the disciples' question is that the disciples wanted to know where the events Jesus was telling them about would take place. Luke 17 - Duty, Thankfulness and the Kingdom A. Forgiveness, faith and duty. Because this Greek word has been used in a judgment passage of . son in law, and thy sons, and thy (NIV). Why have different Bibles translated the Greek word duodifferently? Two women will be grinding at the mill; one will be taken and one will be left. and the other shall be left. Is it possible to create a concave light? Luke 17. (36) But I say unto you, That every idle word that men shall speak, The eagles are the MULTITUDE of the words spoken by the unbelievers as they will persecute those who leave their churches for the Word of Truth when they hear and receive it with joy. " It is quite clear that both scriptures are about the same event and that it is related to the warnings of the end of the age and the Lords return. They will want you to return evil for their evil when they speak against you for receiving it. The people "left behind" - These are non Christians. There will be two women grinding at the same place; one will be taken and the other will be left. Thus eagles in Luke 17:37 could refer angels. There are many Antichrists but one body of Christ. These two signs will occur at the same time and will send an unmistakable message to 144,000 Jewish men who will instantly turn to Jesus Christ. them, Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered bear them now. not open the mouth to render evil for their evil. See texts below. could be that the taken are the people who were steadfast in their faith in the face of danger, so saving their lives for eternity. "( Matthew 24:38 NRSV, Luke 17:26). Matthew 24:40-41 (NASB). Whom did you cite saying this? righteousness, and of judgment: (9) Of sin, because they believe not Then and only then will his will be done perfectly on earth as it is in heaven. If the rapture had occurred, then the dead have already risen because Paul . What he appears to be saying is that the "where" of the events of that "great and terrible Day of the Lord" (Malachi 4:5) will be evident by the human carnage taking place all over the earth, and wherever there is human carnage there will be carrion-eating birds (more likely vultures than eagles) feasting on the flesh of human corpses. Luke 17:34 (NKJV). . In verses 20-21, of Luke's account, Jesus warns the disciples saying, But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies, then know that its by John Dart October 26, 2011 Guest Post But the door of our mouths is to remain shut . There will be two women grinding together. I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. So it is not a valid argument to reason that because Jesus was speaking to Jewish disciples before Pentecost He could not be referring to the Rapture of the Church. Jesus second illustration in verse 35 is about two people who will be grinding at a mill. Two shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left. The answer is no! First I must acknowledge that faithful men may take a different view but the important thing is not to take any position simply because a particular scholar teaches it. whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you It has come to my attention, and as I understand it, that those who insist that the rapture verses of Matthew 24:40-41 and Luke 17:34-36 are, in their opinion, a judgment of the unsaved, are saying that the Greek word "paralambn" - as found in another passage of Scripture - can carry the connotation of judgment. We who believe must ARISE and go from here and snatch others from the coming fire as well. In each case of separation, the ones taken were saved and the ones left were the ones destroyed. The ones left are simply non Christians hence people who are of no concern to the Anti-Christ. That says, "I tell you, on that night there will be two in one bed; one will be taken and the other will be left. Inded, welcome! Jesus said: And other sheep I have, which are not of this fold (Israel): them also I must bring, and they shall hear my voice; and there shall be one flock (Jew and Gentile in the Church), and one shepherd (Christ the head of the Church) (John 10:16). What Is the Difference Between 'Man' And 'Son of Man' in Num 23:19? pass, that, when it is come to pass, ye might believe. It didnt make sense to me so I compared Luke 17 and Matthew 24, looking for similarities and hoping that would shed light on what Jesus meant. : Right now the kingdom of God is within the hearts of people, but then--whenever then is--the Kingdom of God will come in spectacular fashion to bring about "the end of the age.". After answering the Pharisees in Luke 17, Jesus said: I tell you, in that night there shall be two in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. The message is destruction. Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together (Luke17:37). When Jesus discusses the cost of discipleship in Luke who are the kings at war and what do they symbolize? daughters, and whatsoever thou hast in the city, bring them out of giving in marriage, until the day Noah entered the ark, 39 and they (34) O generation of vipers, how can ye, Real Answers. (33) Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and Luke 17:35 (NASB) Matthew 24:40-41 communicates the same facts. But that does not in itself mean that Jesus did not speak about the Rapture of the Church. ai thinker esp32 cam datasheet For more information about this event, we must read Matthew 25:31-46. together. promises to Israel as a people and nation (see next tenet) are not the same as for the Bride of Christ, the Church. the angels hastened Lot, saying, Arise, take thy wife, and thy two But in Luke the body is a living saving body. me no more; (11) Of judgment, because the prince of this world is one that judgeth him: the word that I have spoken, the same shall Literalising the scripture with a carnal mentality, wud just lead one astray to his own peril. And I saw the beast and the kings of the earth with their armies gathered to make war against him who was sitting on the horse and against his army. again, This one fellow came in to sojourn, and he will needs be a Our aim is to share the Word and be true to it. them, Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered.. mountains, let those who are in the midst of her depart, and let not Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. "'" The New International Version (NIV) has avoided the word men and so translates the passage with people. Here is the verse, I tell you, on that night two people will be in one bed; one will be taken and the other left. Luke 16. If these passages are parallel, then the birds of prey refer to events evident in the heavens that point to judgment on earth. away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. Luke 17:34-35 (KJV) - I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. Watch therefore: for ye know not what hour your Lord doth come. This chart shows the flow of events as: 1) The Antichrist at Point 1. (8) And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of That is, birds of prey visible in the heavens congregate and devour corpses on earth. New Living Translation That night two people will be asleep in one bed; one will be taken, the other left. Points 10 and 11 (Luke 17:34-35) say that "one will be taken and the other left" and this is the Rapture. The people "taken" - These are Christians who are tracked down after Christianity is outlawed and arrested. 2) The Great Tribulation at Point 3. " (27) For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. Alstorph. Thank you for your response! Recommend reading Luke 17:20-37 for better understanding, the parallel in Matthew below is a slightly different, this is because Jesus repeated many things as he preached from town to town. Eagles go for bodies, vultures go for corpses. In other words, the image of "taking" may have the wider meaning of destruction as in the "taking" of life, which does not have to include the idea of rapture or snatching away, since there will be seven months of burying human remains after the supernatural intervention of the Lord to save Israel (Ezek 39:12). Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but After He has defeated the nations of the world who attempted to annihilate Israel, He will judge everyone who survived Armageddon. In Luke I believe that we are seeing the body of Christ (the church) being raptured the be with the Lord in the air where eagles gather. Luke 17:34-36 Some use Luke 17:34-36 to teach the secret rapture belief but to understand the complete picture of this passage, we need to read the verses before and after. Jesus indicates that the world will be evil like the days of Noah and like the days of Lot. Is it referring to the Rapture? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together. (35) A good man out of the good treasure of the *. Like the lightning that flashes in the sky, these phenomena in the heavens "illuminate" the Day of the Lord when the spiritually dead are judged on earth. Big difference. It is described in Matthew 25:31-46. We would do well to expand the context of the passage under consideration by going to verse 20 in the same chapter, where the Pharisees questioned Jesus about when the kingdom of God was coming. whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it. 25 'Ye are sons of the prophets, and of the covenant that God made unto our fathers, saying unto Abraham: And in thy seed shall be blessed all the families of the earth; @ Constantthin: On reading your profile I noticed Proverbs 25:2 "It is the glory of God to conceal a matter" (NASB) God rightfully keeps some things secret from mankind until it is due to reveal them. I'll give my take on what I feel this is meaning. Another example given by Jesus ( a few verses earlier) was that of Lot, who was "taken along" by the angel and the others were abandoned. All the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven are the multitude of words that will fly out of the mouths of all the unbelievers in this coming time.and it is by our words that we are justified and it is by our own words that we are condemned. What I put forward is not my view but what the text clearly teaches. I realized the disciples were asking where the taken where taken (in Luke 17:37), so then Jesus answer made sense literally: vultures will eat the carcasses of people (the wicked) who die. Ezekiel 39:12. I always used to believe that phrase was about a Pre-Tribulation Rapture, but in Jesus context, it means the wicked are taken (die) and the rest are left alive. Jesus faulted the Pharisees for missing (ignoring) the signs of the times: His own day WAS the "last days"! Who is being "taken" in Matthew 24:40-41? (7) For the mystery of iniquity The Lord shall consume them with the Spirit of His mouth as they will gnash their teeth in rage against what they hear Him saying and will speak all kinds of evil in resistance which will destroy themselves. with the brightness of his coming: The wicked will be tormented in the presence of the Lamb as we keep His sacrifice when the persecute us. Let both grow together until the harvest, and at harvest time I will tell the reapers, "Gather the weeds FIRST and bind them in bundles to be burned, but gather the wheat into my barn. G105 Eagle (or vulture) Could also read; Wheresoever the body shall be, thither will the eagles. The word for eagle occurs 4 times in the New Testament and always from the same Greek word. Luke 17:34 This is not the sudden catching up (or rapture) of believers as described in 1 Thess 4:13-18 when Christ returns in the air (not to earth), and gathers believers to be with Him. In this respect, if we continue to compare Luke with Matthew, the ones "taken" (Matt 24:40-41, NASB) are similar to those "taken" at the flood of Noah (Matt 24:39, NASB). other left. Bulk update symbol size units from mm to map units in rule-based symbology. At the very same moment the head of the Revived Roman Empire will sign a 7 year peace treaty and Jews will be able to rebuild their temple. The literal meaning of the words must agree with the context. We are to leave it all behind (all of their church thoughts and ways) and take nothing of them with us so that we follow the Lord in His footsteps and suffer without the camp by the keeping of His sacrifice as they will persecute us for leaving them. shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left. (Luke 17:34) The day that the Son of Man is revealed seems to be the same day on which destruction comes, the day when one is taken and another left. 17:37 1881 Westcott-Hort New Testament (WHNU), 37 0 Was Jesus talking about the rapture or judgment in Luke 17:34-37? and what I should speak. Then I saw an angel standing in the sun, and with a loud voice he called to all the birds that fly directly overhead, "Come, gather for the great supper of God, to eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of captains, the flesh of mighty men, the flesh of horses and their riders, and the flesh of all men, both free and slave, both small and great." 28 "Likewise, just as it was in the days of Lot: they were eating and 37 "Where, Lord?" they asked. Matthew 13:30 . By clicking Post Your Answer, you agree to our terms of service, privacy policy and cookie policy. Check out ourBible Answerspage for more information on a variety of topics. THE RAPTURE, A SECRET UNTIL JESUS CHRIST REVEALED IT TO PAUL Attempting to argue against those who say Jesus never preached about the Rapture, people will take Jesus' words in Matthew 24:40-41 and Luke 17:34-36 about individuals being taken away, and make them apply to people being taken to heaven in the Rapture. daughters, which are here; lest thou be consumed in the iniquity of And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? Some will hear and believe and come out from among the unbelievers (the dead body) who will not believe in the revealed Word of Truth when they hear it. When you get a chance, please take the. There we discover Luke 17:30-35 and Matthew 24:37-41 are illustrations of the Judgment of the Nations, which is also called the Sheep and Goat Judgment (Matthew 25:31-46). Commentators have noted that Jesus employed a proverbial saying to reply to his disciples' question, "Where, Lord?" (Luke 17:37a); however, they differ on what the proverb means in this context. Jesus prayer was answered when Jew and Gentile became ONE in Christ on the day of Pentecost. It will be like the days of Noah and the days of Lot; days of violence and every mans imaginations and thoughts only evil continually! Please. That article doesn't deal with Lk 17:34-37. The "brightness of His presence" = the keeping of His sacrifice (the Lamb) in our lives in the persecution by not returning evil for their evil. Revelation 19:17-18 KJV (17) And I saw an angel standing in the sun; Not to a rotting carcase but to the living body that rose from the dead and is alive for evermore! Next, Jesus said once again one will be taken and one left. Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the of Man is revealed. This is the great judgment/wrath at Christ's Second Coming, when God kills His enemies and instructs scavenger-birds to gather and eat their corpses (Revelation 19:17-21). A remnant will survive. Most of the entries in the NAME column of the output from lsof +D /tmp do not begin with /tmp. Is Matthew 24:30-31 about the rapture or second coming. In other words, they will experience the glory and not the gory! It is also agreed that the words were spoken to Jewish disciples BEFORE the Church began on the day of Pentecost. Some interpret the word taken to mean, taken in judgment at the second coming of Christ but what does the Greek word mean? When it comes, it will be as obvious as the lightning which flashes and lights up the entire sky. Therefore the Disciples could not have understood that Jesus might be speaking about the Rapture of the Church. English Standard Version As for the "where question," Jesus' apparently cryptic answer is really quite straightforward. PO Box 4216 The answer begins by understanding that duosimply means two. The word can refer to two men, two women, two children, a mother and a child, or two of anything. Doesnt Luke 17:34-36 support the secret rapture belief? " horses, and of them that sit on them, and the flesh of all men, both Antichrist will be slain with his False Prophet and they will be given their resurrection bodies and cast alive into the lake of fire. Jesus indicated that the people taken will be killed when the disciples asked "taken where?" 36 But about that day and hour no one knows, neither the angels of So I've been dwelling on Luke 17:34-36 I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left. One will be taken and the other left. Again, we learn that the people taken out of the city were the saved. But, we must also "Arise up" and get outjust as Lot was commanded to do. To subscribe to this RSS feed, copy and paste this URL into your RSS reader. And he said unto them, wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together (Luke 17:37). be the coming of the Son of Man. Many people use these words to support a concept called the rapture. The following accounts in Matthew and Luke are the primary scriptures used to teach the idea of a secret rapture. and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in Their very own words will eat the flesh of those who will (in unbelief) resist what the Spirit says in this coming time in the Day of Judgment. Thank you! 36 Two men will be in the field; one will be taken and the other left.

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